Why is Jared “Corruption” Kushner even involved in this?
taisui on
“ambition” is such a weird word of choice
SHOOHS on
Ukraine should most definitely be in NATO but here we are. This current timeline is backwards.
thomasbeagle on
“NATO? That old thing? Sure, we can give that up. But we aim to be a founding member of the European Defence Alliance.”
ruinousshe on
NATO needs Ukraine.
CatalyticDragon on
Why does Russia (and therefore the US) want this? Because a ceasefire gives Russia time to rebuild forces and then when they *inevitably* attack again Ukraine won’t have NATO support.
Ukraine should agree to nothing except a full withdrawal with no conditions and they should continue to seek NATO membership.
everything_is_bad on
Seems like Ukraine should be in nato
dbxp on
I wonder if this is more that NATO isn’t so valuable under Trump especially with Poland’s and Germany’s large armoured vehicle orders
Soljah on
Do you blame him? Literally all of his allies have failed him
malachiconstantjrjr on
Like words mean anything to Russia, just say ‘ We won’t join NATO’ then go fucking join NATO. What are they going to do? Invade again and lose another 1.25 million of their population? Something something Warsaw Pact…
djangovsjango on
Build nukes again instead then do as you please
MCR_Read4737 on
I don’t blame him. Stand on your truth.
Dookie120 on
It’s good to have this on the table. Ukraine becoming a NATO member especially right now was always a negotiating tactic. Membership usually takes years even after formal application & required reforms are done. During an active war they also cant get it. If they can somehow get real security guarantees by offering this up now it’ll be fine.
gym_fun on
I’m sorry for Zelenskyy. Trump already weakened NATO…
Peach-Grand on
Maybe they can agree that if Russia invades again it’s an automatic joining of NATO.
fuzzyfrank on
If anyone here gets the chance, please watch 2000 Meters to Andriivka. It just came out, and it’s free on YouTube and documents the intense fighting and sacrifices of this war. Published by The AP and PBS, same director as 20 Days in Mariupol. Well worth the 2 hours.
That would require changing their constitution. And, AFAIR, Zelenskyy has always maintained that they can’t concede any land because that would require changing their constitution, which requires a referendum.
So what has changed for him to promise this?
Safety_Drance on
And that’s how you know the war and all efforts to stop Russia have been for nothing.
A war of attrition they would have won with US support except that Putin has pictures of Trump blowing either a horse or a man named Bubba.
Meanwhile, time to go to war with Venezuela for some reason. A country that despite Trump and conservative media claims, does not actually produce or smuggle fentanyl into the US.
AlexandbroTheGreat on
The European countries that matter militarily need to separately conclude a pact with Ukraine if they believe the US is unreliable. Ukrainian forces will be very important to the balance of power in Europe for a long time and the other Europeans need to worry less about what they will do if Russia attacks Ukraine again and more about locking in Ukrainian participation against Russia if the Baltics are invaded.
brickyardjimmy on
With Trump as the U.S. president, it’s kinda off the table anyway.
10v1 on
Oh don’t do that. Anything but that.
groovyinutah on
Just say whatever you gotta say to get them to leave and you can reconsider later…that’s what they would do.
Immediate_Formal_252 on
Just goes to show how piss weak NATO has been and will be forever
abc123DohRayMe on
Trump is ruining NATO anyway. Europe can do up a new treaty organization and invite Ukraine to join.
ScarletViolin on
This is probably obvious to some people but I finally realized that Trump actively undermining NATO / making fun of EU to weaken the alliance was probably to try and steer Ukraine towards this as a bargaining chip.
Maybe I’m giving the Alzheimer in chief too much credit though.
Ok_Freedom_6864 on
Ukraine doesn’t need NATO anymore. Their missiles can now reach Moscow, and they have better aim than the Russians. Putin doesn’t want to live in a bunker every night like a rat so he will make a deal pretty fast.
tosser1579 on
Trump is doing his best to gut NATO so there is no real point in joining a dying organization. Russia is obviously thrilled.
ZLUCremisi on
EU would be more effective for Ukraine
Adept-Mulberry-8720 on
No! NATO is your saving coin!
seangraves1984 on
They left out the part of kyiv cane back with a 20 point counter. One of those points was that would not rescind nato application. This is biased and click bait.
Triekster on
NATO is pretty much europe now, so joining europe would be the same as joining NATO. It would give putin a technical victory point but it would be a completely meaningless victory point.
Cynical_Classicist on
I mean, NATO feels like a joke now, with it’s main member affiliated with Russia.
33 Comments
Why is Jared “Corruption” Kushner even involved in this?
“ambition” is such a weird word of choice
Ukraine should most definitely be in NATO but here we are. This current timeline is backwards.
“NATO? That old thing? Sure, we can give that up. But we aim to be a founding member of the European Defence Alliance.”
NATO needs Ukraine.
Why does Russia (and therefore the US) want this? Because a ceasefire gives Russia time to rebuild forces and then when they *inevitably* attack again Ukraine won’t have NATO support.
Ukraine should agree to nothing except a full withdrawal with no conditions and they should continue to seek NATO membership.
Seems like Ukraine should be in nato
I wonder if this is more that NATO isn’t so valuable under Trump especially with Poland’s and Germany’s large armoured vehicle orders
Do you blame him? Literally all of his allies have failed him
Like words mean anything to Russia, just say ‘ We won’t join NATO’ then go fucking join NATO. What are they going to do? Invade again and lose another 1.25 million of their population? Something something Warsaw Pact…
Build nukes again instead then do as you please
I don’t blame him. Stand on your truth.
It’s good to have this on the table. Ukraine becoming a NATO member especially right now was always a negotiating tactic. Membership usually takes years even after formal application & required reforms are done. During an active war they also cant get it. If they can somehow get real security guarantees by offering this up now it’ll be fine.
I’m sorry for Zelenskyy. Trump already weakened NATO…
Maybe they can agree that if Russia invades again it’s an automatic joining of NATO.
If anyone here gets the chance, please watch 2000 Meters to Andriivka. It just came out, and it’s free on YouTube and documents the intense fighting and sacrifices of this war. Published by The AP and PBS, same director as 20 Days in Mariupol. Well worth the 2 hours.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=Nf4Cgy56slU
That would require changing their constitution. And, AFAIR, Zelenskyy has always maintained that they can’t concede any land because that would require changing their constitution, which requires a referendum.
So what has changed for him to promise this?
And that’s how you know the war and all efforts to stop Russia have been for nothing.
A war of attrition they would have won with US support except that Putin has pictures of Trump blowing either a horse or a man named Bubba.
Meanwhile, time to go to war with Venezuela for some reason. A country that despite Trump and conservative media claims, does not actually produce or smuggle fentanyl into the US.
The European countries that matter militarily need to separately conclude a pact with Ukraine if they believe the US is unreliable. Ukrainian forces will be very important to the balance of power in Europe for a long time and the other Europeans need to worry less about what they will do if Russia attacks Ukraine again and more about locking in Ukrainian participation against Russia if the Baltics are invaded.
With Trump as the U.S. president, it’s kinda off the table anyway.
Oh don’t do that. Anything but that.
Just say whatever you gotta say to get them to leave and you can reconsider later…that’s what they would do.
Just goes to show how piss weak NATO has been and will be forever
Trump is ruining NATO anyway. Europe can do up a new treaty organization and invite Ukraine to join.
This is probably obvious to some people but I finally realized that Trump actively undermining NATO / making fun of EU to weaken the alliance was probably to try and steer Ukraine towards this as a bargaining chip.
Maybe I’m giving the Alzheimer in chief too much credit though.
Ukraine doesn’t need NATO anymore. Their missiles can now reach Moscow, and they have better aim than the Russians. Putin doesn’t want to live in a bunker every night like a rat so he will make a deal pretty fast.
Trump is doing his best to gut NATO so there is no real point in joining a dying organization. Russia is obviously thrilled.
EU would be more effective for Ukraine
No! NATO is your saving coin!
They left out the part of kyiv cane back with a 20 point counter. One of those points was that would not rescind nato application. This is biased and click bait.
NATO is pretty much europe now, so joining europe would be the same as joining NATO. It would give putin a technical victory point but it would be a completely meaningless victory point.
I mean, NATO feels like a joke now, with it’s main member affiliated with Russia.
Just lie until the war’s over and then join NATO.