To me this is a great example of why we need to pool defence procurement with the rest of the EU. There is no point in using bespoke Irish defence procurement talents when collective EU processes are available.
And of course it would mean parts and skills for maintenance would also be cheaper.
It has nothing to do with war fighting alliances. It’s is simply pooling resources to avoid wastes of public money. Something a union like the EU was made for.
But my big question is, why isn’t there a single article in the Irish media that reveals this procurement failure before now?? This secret failure has been kept secret for 16 years!!
Worth mentioning that using EU pooled procurement doesn’t guarantee success either. It’s just about derisking it.
Pension_Alternative on
These vehicles cost €726,000 each!
>Problems with the vehicles were evident from the start. Users reported severe reliability and maintenance issues including electrical connections not matching up and driveshafts shearing off.
“They were a bit of a running joke,” said one military source.
>“The problem was they bought an immature platform which had not been vetted in the field by bigger militaries. Then they started adding loads on to them, which made them more complicated and less reliable.”
>Former TD and Army Ranger wing commandant Cathal Berry said the LTAVs were “a disaster” and their purchase offered valuable lessons as Ireland looks at spending hundreds of millions on military equipment in the coming years.
HugoZHackenbush2 on
>French replacements
I hope these replacements are reliable, otherwise it’s a lot of money Toulouse..
Fine-Shirt-8214 on
Sounds like nothing new for the Irish Government. See the printer incident and many other examples.
SeriesDowntown5947 on
The government are buying everything from france. Need to diversity in supply. Noting nato standards.
Bohemian_Dub on
On oversea trip they were jacked up and spun over to artificially increase speedo to make it look like they were being used that’s how useless they were.mowak which we use the piranha from make an eagle jeep which is top class.
EmiliaPains- on
>Mileage figures provided under Freedom of Information legislation show the vehicles recorded low mileage during their 15-year lifetime. One vehicle drove an annual average of 540km, the rough equivalent of one full fuel tank a year.
That’s actually so sad, “€726,000” each and only ran through a full tank of petrol a year equating to 8,100 kilometres over the entire service period that’s more mileage than my mother’s 2021 Hyundai (200k)
saggynaggy123 on
I hope these vehicles being retired will be put into Collins Baracks and other museums
Yosarrian_lives on
So the lesson is buy tried and tested tech.
The scorpian programme is not tried and tested. Only the French and Belgians have them and relatively recently. Not been deployed anywhere. And there is already contoversy in BE over the cost. So no way we would hear about any teething problems.
We should go with mowag again. Tried and tested in many variants and countries. I am sure there must be some benefit is the same manufacturer. Much common parts, tool, tyres maybe etc
Also French military doctrine is pretty unique. We would be far better aligning with the Nordics who we work alot with. Danes and swedes use mowag. Or go with the patria and Finns. Same concept.
13 Comments
To me this is a great example of why we need to pool defence procurement with the rest of the EU. There is no point in using bespoke Irish defence procurement talents when collective EU processes are available.
And of course it would mean parts and skills for maintenance would also be cheaper.
It has nothing to do with war fighting alliances. It’s is simply pooling resources to avoid wastes of public money. Something a union like the EU was made for.
Here’s a south African article about the original purchase https://defenceweb.co.za/land/land-land/bae-systems-wins-r200-million-irish-order/
But my big question is, why isn’t there a single article in the Irish media that reveals this procurement failure before now?? This secret failure has been kept secret for 16 years!!
Worth mentioning that using EU pooled procurement doesn’t guarantee success either. It’s just about derisking it.
These vehicles cost €726,000 each!
>Problems with the vehicles were evident from the start. Users reported severe reliability and maintenance issues including electrical connections not matching up and driveshafts shearing off.
“They were a bit of a running joke,” said one military source.
>“The problem was they bought an immature platform which had not been vetted in the field by bigger militaries. Then they started adding loads on to them, which made them more complicated and less reliable.”
>Former TD and Army Ranger wing commandant Cathal Berry said the LTAVs were “a disaster” and their purchase offered valuable lessons as Ireland looks at spending hundreds of millions on military equipment in the coming years.
>French replacements
I hope these replacements are reliable, otherwise it’s a lot of money Toulouse..
Sounds like nothing new for the Irish Government. See the printer incident and many other examples.
The government are buying everything from france. Need to diversity in supply. Noting nato standards.
On oversea trip they were jacked up and spun over to artificially increase speedo to make it look like they were being used that’s how useless they were.mowak which we use the piranha from make an eagle jeep which is top class.
>Mileage figures provided under Freedom of Information legislation show the vehicles recorded low mileage during their 15-year lifetime. One vehicle drove an annual average of 540km, the rough equivalent of one full fuel tank a year.
That’s actually so sad, “€726,000” each and only ran through a full tank of petrol a year equating to 8,100 kilometres over the entire service period that’s more mileage than my mother’s 2021 Hyundai (200k)
I hope these vehicles being retired will be put into Collins Baracks and other museums
So the lesson is buy tried and tested tech.
The scorpian programme is not tried and tested. Only the French and Belgians have them and relatively recently. Not been deployed anywhere. And there is already contoversy in BE over the cost. So no way we would hear about any teething problems.
We should go with mowag again. Tried and tested in many variants and countries. I am sure there must be some benefit is the same manufacturer. Much common parts, tool, tyres maybe etc
Also French military doctrine is pretty unique. We would be far better aligning with the Nordics who we work alot with. Danes and swedes use mowag. Or go with the patria and Finns. Same concept.
The wiki page for it
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RG_Outrider
Why the fuck do we have to pay for this when we can never own a house?
We don’t have an armoured fleet. We’ve APCs with the odd one equiped with a 30mm.
Realistically do these actually get used?
Just a question for someone in the know, why not purchase the Irish made APCs ?