As countless international studies repeatedly show, increasing public transport significantly increases demand for public transport. Introducing congestion charges has limited effects and just moves traffic elsewhere while hitting working class hardest. One of these studies was done in Ireland too with the Local Link service.
Sharp_Fuel on
What ever happened to carrot and the stick? Now it’s just the stick, encourage dense apartment building in the city, build proper transport infrastructure and you’ll solve the traffic issue
oddun on
Fix the fucking traffic lights before you do anything else!
OldVillageNuaGuitar on
The current approach has been to make driving around the city difficult, through the use of bus gates, turn restrictions and some (lets be honest, exceptionally limited) pedestrianisation.
That’s fine, it can be very confusing if you’re not familiar with the city though. But the big place we’re falling down is that we hardly enforce it.
I think for many people a congestion charge would make driving into Dublin on the rare times they need to much easier, while also stopping a lot of the bad behaviour we see now. But we could also solve a lot of that bad behaviour with camera based enforcement of some of the existing rules.
NocturneFogg on
London is a bad comparison as it has the highly developed underground network and is able to keep cars out.
Dublin is a medium, but rapidly growing city with a love of sprawling suburbs and very underinvested public transit infrastructure.
thereforewhat on
Totally the right time for this given the shelving of public transport projects.
If Dublin had London levels of public transportation nobody would argue with this.
It just doesn’t though.
Banania2020 on
Yep, a proper working from home policy is badly needed. The actual one is a joke.
qwerty_1965 on
All static desk bound public servants esp civil service should be mandated to WFH unless requested to be elsewhere.
hcpanther on
Sure glad we had those incessant campaigns against bus lanes and cycle lanes and metro and on and on and on
trvlr93 on
Im shocked.
Traffic issues in a city with 2 tram lines and an ageing coastal railway, no metro, no densification and very few main arterial roads…
trvlr93 on
Im shocked.
Traffic issues in a city with 2 tram lines and an ageing coastal railway, no metro, no densification and very few main arterial roads…
MeccIt on
Where’s the bus lane cameras *on* the busses? The €60 fine for all the SUVs that happily use them as their own lane would free up bus lanes overnight, and encourage more people to take the speedy busses?
Sorcha125 on
We just need one more lane!
Lawfulraccoon on
Such a short sighted suggestion. Let’s compare it to London where they have a decent public transport network.
Like the quays closure and traffic light changes, I can’t understand why you’d put these things in place without an alternative.
It’s like these experts think we want to sit in cars for hours a day.
Bosco_is_a_prick on
Bus connect was announced 8 years ago and construction hasn’t started on a single one of the bus corridors
ruthemook on
You cannot put charges in place without providing first a viable alternative. This is why light rail and metro systems need to be prioritised. Why are we still pretending this is a debate.
alistair1537 on
Yeah, we shouldn’t fix the problem.We should charge the consumer more. This is the Irish way.
ElectricalFox893 on
True feckin story. It’s mental out there.
Internal-Cobbler9140 on
Step 26: Reduce road space, remove infrastructure for the masses that are no longer required and replace with recreational and “nice to have” infrastructure, such as extensive cycle lane network.
That was the step DCC started with when addressing congestion in Dublin. Which now means that the city bypass, the M50, is the main / only passage to get around the city (rather than going through it) for the vast majority of residents.
On Nassau street, there is a bus lane, a single traffic lane and a cycle lane 1.5 times the width of the bus lane, could probably accommodate 4 to 5 cyclists side by side within its span. I work in the area and walk that street regularly, at least 50% of the cyclists don’t use the absurdly wide cycle lane because the flow of the traffic lane is more convenient for turning, towards Pearse St.
On the quays, approaching O,Connell bridge from the east, there is a bus lane, a single one way traffic lane and a two lane cycle lane to accommodate cyclists going in both directions on BOTH sides of the river.
I get it that cycling infrastructure is an amazing thing to have in a city, i fully support it, mainly from a safety perspective, and i can understand why cyclists are so protective over the projects, but from a purely logical standpoint, how can any sane person think reducing infrastructure for the masses without providing alternatives is a good idea, even if it means it’s replaced with niche infrastructure that suits your needs.
Its not a case of “just get a bike”, not everyone lives within reasonable cycling distance, our planning failures mean we have a low density urban sprawl that more or less captures the entire province of Leinster as the Dublin commuter belt, and trust me, I work with people who commute 3 times a week into the city from Louth, Wexford, Kildare, Carlow to name a few, also commercial vehicles can’t be replaced with bikes.
No matter how much you want it to make sense in Dublin, you can’t use utopian examples of cycling cities and apply them to Dublin without considering we have the most underdeveloped public transport infrastructure of any EU country.
Reduce road space and make green and cycling space when you have an inner city multiple line underground metro system and extensive overground tramway system and a functioning bus service and frequent intercity terminas service, all of which is seamlessly interlinked, because then we don’t need the road infrastructure.
But force a square peg through a round hole and reducing transport capacity is insanity.
I know there’s a cult like militant support base for cycle lanes that have no time for rational discussion because they think the entire city should accommodate their personal utopia, but these are the simple facts. God forbid we consider that we have an almost perfect track record of making the wrong planning decisions in this country.
SeriesDowntown5947 on
Shouldn’t we build bus lanes. Maybe convert cycle lanes into bus lanes. To get dublin moving. The stilloran or finglas roads are great examples of this. Then turn onto kill avenue and its slower than walking pace.
slevinonion on
Remember decentralisation. Is it important to have the department of agriculture in Dublin city centre, fisheries in city west etc? IDA spent decades forcing everyone into Dublin.
alangcarter on
WFH as the default is possible, more productive, more envirommentally friendly and would make huge improvements to traffic in Dublin and on the M50. The property developers never guessed that office blocks would become unnecessary, but holding back progress for the convenience of executives who can’t be bothered to evolve is so *American*.
Vivid_Ice_2755 on
There’s a gym at Fairview Clontarf where cars queue to get in ,blocking a bus lane and a cycle path. The dart is next door and buses drive by. It’s accessible by well served public transport. The issue there, which is mirrored across the city, is people prefer sitting in their cars . Whether it’s going to work or school or wherever, traffic is woeful because we prefer cars. Public transport is not always to blame
CliffDagger on
The whole system is under pressure. As frequent as the new E1 bus is in rush hour, it can be so full that often it can be two or three before I can squeeze on. So even if people did ditch the cars because of a congestion charge, that’s just going to make the bus situation worse.
NooktaSt on
Red light cameras
No taxis in bus lanes
Public sector jobs stop providing parking in the city centre, start with the TDs or even ex TDs.
WilsonWaits2 on
Unless there is a specific need it should be made illegal to work from an office rather than WFH
26 Comments
As countless international studies repeatedly show, increasing public transport significantly increases demand for public transport. Introducing congestion charges has limited effects and just moves traffic elsewhere while hitting working class hardest. One of these studies was done in Ireland too with the Local Link service.
What ever happened to carrot and the stick? Now it’s just the stick, encourage dense apartment building in the city, build proper transport infrastructure and you’ll solve the traffic issue
Fix the fucking traffic lights before you do anything else!
The current approach has been to make driving around the city difficult, through the use of bus gates, turn restrictions and some (lets be honest, exceptionally limited) pedestrianisation.
That’s fine, it can be very confusing if you’re not familiar with the city though. But the big place we’re falling down is that we hardly enforce it.
I think for many people a congestion charge would make driving into Dublin on the rare times they need to much easier, while also stopping a lot of the bad behaviour we see now. But we could also solve a lot of that bad behaviour with camera based enforcement of some of the existing rules.
London is a bad comparison as it has the highly developed underground network and is able to keep cars out.
Dublin is a medium, but rapidly growing city with a love of sprawling suburbs and very underinvested public transit infrastructure.
Totally the right time for this given the shelving of public transport projects.
If Dublin had London levels of public transportation nobody would argue with this.
It just doesn’t though.
Yep, a proper working from home policy is badly needed. The actual one is a joke.
All static desk bound public servants esp civil service should be mandated to WFH unless requested to be elsewhere.
Sure glad we had those incessant campaigns against bus lanes and cycle lanes and metro and on and on and on
Im shocked.
Traffic issues in a city with 2 tram lines and an ageing coastal railway, no metro, no densification and very few main arterial roads…
Im shocked.
Traffic issues in a city with 2 tram lines and an ageing coastal railway, no metro, no densification and very few main arterial roads…
Where’s the bus lane cameras *on* the busses? The €60 fine for all the SUVs that happily use them as their own lane would free up bus lanes overnight, and encourage more people to take the speedy busses?
We just need one more lane!
Such a short sighted suggestion. Let’s compare it to London where they have a decent public transport network.
Like the quays closure and traffic light changes, I can’t understand why you’d put these things in place without an alternative.
It’s like these experts think we want to sit in cars for hours a day.
Bus connect was announced 8 years ago and construction hasn’t started on a single one of the bus corridors
You cannot put charges in place without providing first a viable alternative. This is why light rail and metro systems need to be prioritised. Why are we still pretending this is a debate.
Yeah, we shouldn’t fix the problem.We should charge the consumer more. This is the Irish way.
True feckin story. It’s mental out there.
Step 26: Reduce road space, remove infrastructure for the masses that are no longer required and replace with recreational and “nice to have” infrastructure, such as extensive cycle lane network.
That was the step DCC started with when addressing congestion in Dublin. Which now means that the city bypass, the M50, is the main / only passage to get around the city (rather than going through it) for the vast majority of residents.
On Nassau street, there is a bus lane, a single traffic lane and a cycle lane 1.5 times the width of the bus lane, could probably accommodate 4 to 5 cyclists side by side within its span. I work in the area and walk that street regularly, at least 50% of the cyclists don’t use the absurdly wide cycle lane because the flow of the traffic lane is more convenient for turning, towards Pearse St.
On the quays, approaching O,Connell bridge from the east, there is a bus lane, a single one way traffic lane and a two lane cycle lane to accommodate cyclists going in both directions on BOTH sides of the river.
I get it that cycling infrastructure is an amazing thing to have in a city, i fully support it, mainly from a safety perspective, and i can understand why cyclists are so protective over the projects, but from a purely logical standpoint, how can any sane person think reducing infrastructure for the masses without providing alternatives is a good idea, even if it means it’s replaced with niche infrastructure that suits your needs.
Its not a case of “just get a bike”, not everyone lives within reasonable cycling distance, our planning failures mean we have a low density urban sprawl that more or less captures the entire province of Leinster as the Dublin commuter belt, and trust me, I work with people who commute 3 times a week into the city from Louth, Wexford, Kildare, Carlow to name a few, also commercial vehicles can’t be replaced with bikes.
No matter how much you want it to make sense in Dublin, you can’t use utopian examples of cycling cities and apply them to Dublin without considering we have the most underdeveloped public transport infrastructure of any EU country.
Reduce road space and make green and cycling space when you have an inner city multiple line underground metro system and extensive overground tramway system and a functioning bus service and frequent intercity terminas service, all of which is seamlessly interlinked, because then we don’t need the road infrastructure.
But force a square peg through a round hole and reducing transport capacity is insanity.
I know there’s a cult like militant support base for cycle lanes that have no time for rational discussion because they think the entire city should accommodate their personal utopia, but these are the simple facts. God forbid we consider that we have an almost perfect track record of making the wrong planning decisions in this country.
Shouldn’t we build bus lanes. Maybe convert cycle lanes into bus lanes. To get dublin moving. The stilloran or finglas roads are great examples of this. Then turn onto kill avenue and its slower than walking pace.
Remember decentralisation. Is it important to have the department of agriculture in Dublin city centre, fisheries in city west etc? IDA spent decades forcing everyone into Dublin.
WFH as the default is possible, more productive, more envirommentally friendly and would make huge improvements to traffic in Dublin and on the M50. The property developers never guessed that office blocks would become unnecessary, but holding back progress for the convenience of executives who can’t be bothered to evolve is so *American*.
There’s a gym at Fairview Clontarf where cars queue to get in ,blocking a bus lane and a cycle path. The dart is next door and buses drive by. It’s accessible by well served public transport. The issue there, which is mirrored across the city, is people prefer sitting in their cars . Whether it’s going to work or school or wherever, traffic is woeful because we prefer cars. Public transport is not always to blame
The whole system is under pressure. As frequent as the new E1 bus is in rush hour, it can be so full that often it can be two or three before I can squeeze on. So even if people did ditch the cars because of a congestion charge, that’s just going to make the bus situation worse.
Red light cameras
No taxis in bus lanes
Public sector jobs stop providing parking in the city centre, start with the TDs or even ex TDs.
Unless there is a specific need it should be made illegal to work from an office rather than WFH