Has anyone ever been charged with an offence for fighting back during a home invasion?
MJcorrieviewer on
Has the frequency of home invasions really become that big of a problem these days?
[deleted] on
[removed]
Hawkeye_Swift on
I don’t want to go nuts on a burglar, but I also don’t want to be dragged through the court or have my life ruined with legal fees (~$30-$50K) if I err on the side of caution when faced with a threat in my own home.
My position on this issue is hardening due to the increase of violent invasions in Ontario – up over 50% in recent years – even though it looks like the number of burglaries has fallen by over 50% since 2000 (I know, seems unlikely but those do appear to be the stats).
Some countries have a system to recover court costs from the state when charges are withdrawn, or a higher bar to bring charges prior to a full investigation. Perhaps we can model their system to fit our needs, versus this seemingly ham-fisted approach?
break_from_work on
My home is my sanctuary where I’m suppose to feel the safest and for the life of me I cannot understand why I don’t have the right to feel safe inside my home and defend it should someone try to invade my space. I’m not the one who’s in the wrong, the person(s) trying to rob me or steal from me are 100% in the wrong and I should be able to defend it. There’s no place like home.
Kampfux on
Just an FYI so people understand.
It’s not Police who WANT to charge homeowners for defending themselves. It’s the Prosecutor and Crown that pushes and demands Police lay charges.
I can tell you with experience no Police officer goes to calls like this and say “ya I want to arrest and charge this homeowner for defending himself”.
eleventhrees on
Conservatives out of ideas. News at 11.
No-Turnip7033 on
When you don’t know the intent of an intruder, and you don’t know whether they are armed or not, and you don’t know if there is more than one of them, you are at a disadvantage. That should lead to being given the benefit of the doubt. Why should the homeowner have to gamble with their life when they have no knowledge of the intent of the intruder? The intruder has the upper hand.
TheSilentPrince on
I’ve been downvoted time and again, but I still stand by the belief that the Americans have the right idea with their *2nd Amendment, Constitutional Carry*, and *Stand Your Ground* laws. They are wrong about a lot, but not this. People need to be able to defend themselves, from criminals and foreign aggressors; both of whom will have guns anyway.
The government should have far less power to tell adult citizens what they can’t own, let alone use to defend themselves. If someone starts trouble, and gets killed for it, that’s not a great loss. I doubt we’ll ever get a pro-gun government, so the best that sensible Canadians can hope for is to make good use of Jury Nullification if you’re ever on a self-defense trial.
Chevettez06 on
“Fourteen years later, it’s time for another update, especially given the frequency of home invasions today.” If our government is saying this, why has everyone been saying violent crime is down?
Long_Ad_2764 on
Someone breaks into your home you should be given a lot of leeway. The way I see it is if someone breaks into my home and I call the police when the police arrive they will do so with a gun. If the intruder does not comply with their commands / becomes aggressive the e police will shoot them. I should be able to do the same within my home.
Aether_rite on
so… are we actually gonna get any change in polices or is this just fluff?
izza123 on
I think it’s pretty obvious Canadians want and need stronger self defence.
ThePhyrrus on
And yet, the headline posits ‘the frequency of home invasions these days’ and then completely fails to actually cite data that shows any actual increase in these events.
So here we are just doing a vibes-based encouragement for violence.
Cool.
Cool cool cool.
throwaway1010202020 on
There’s an old farmer that lives up the road from me. Probably 15 years ago there was a rash of thefts on farms in the area. Everyone knew who it was but the cops wouldn’t/couldn’t do anything about it.
Buddy broke into the farmers shed one night and stole a couple gas cans. The cops showed up and the guy was sitting at the end of the driveway, he was in pretty rough shape, cuts and bruises all over.
Cop asked the farmer what happened to him. No idea officer he looked like that when he got here.
The thefts stopped after that night for some reason.
jay370gt on
LPC: won’t somebody please think of the criminals?
easyjimi1974 on
It isn’t outdated. It was absurd at first instance.
henrymak33 on
I thought we were suppose to comply with the criminal. Give them whatever they want including our lives.
jello_sweaters on
>especially given the frequency of home invasions today.
The article provides no data, only fear, so let’s do their work for them:
The *Sun* doesn’t want you to be informed, they just want you to be terrified.
blastbomberboy on
Toronto Sun fear-mongering again…
braytag on
When someone breaks into your home, they have ill intentions by default.
They don’t care about you, your posessions, or the impact their action will have on you.
So in my book, they forfeited their rights.
If a dog kills an intruder, everyone would say it’s a good boy and no prosecutor would try to BE that dog. Why is it different for a home owner?
names-r-hard1127 on
Maybe I’m alone on this but personally I think if you break into someone’s home you should basically forfeit your right to life during the duration of the robbery. Basically make sure these criminals know they are choosing other people’s stuff over their own lives
MinuteCampaign7843 on
Yes, then maybe the trash breaking into peoples homes will think twice.
HurtFeeFeez on
I think most people are in favour of self defense and defense of their property. I’d also believe police are in favour of it as well in principle. It’s a fine line to walk. The law could absolutely be abused to excuse you assaulting someone in your home for example. There are also excessive force limitations that need to be addressed. I want to be able to defend my home but I don’t necessarily want it to be legal for me to mag dump into a couple 15 year olds making a poor decision in search of beer money.
Acrobatic_Day9724 on
Your country lol. Import millions of 3rd worlders, still don’t allow self defense
Temporary_Cry_2802 on
“Frequency of home invasions these days”?!?!?!?! The rate of home break and enters has dropped more than than 70% over the past 30 years.
arthur_z on
+1 💯%agree, especially when you can get hurt and the best medical care you can get is to sit on a stool in a corridor in ER for a day
Thereal_Stormm006 on
The anti-self defence approach to self defence laws is absurd & outdated. It’s time for an update.
LonghornJct08 on
First of all, periodically reviewing and updating laws is probably a prudent thing to be doing anyways. I don’t think there’s much grounds for complaint about that.
Then there’s the issue of lived experience.
This is, or was, a relatively good neighbourhood but every so often, I’d hear from the various neighbours that stuff had been stolen out of cars or they saw someone trying car door handles.
However, last year, actual home invasions crept in right nearby. I came home to a letter from the police department tucked into my mail box last year canvassing for potential witnesses and CCTV footage from a home invasion that took place across the street a few houses down. The letter didn’t have many details but I heard from one of the neighbours who lived on the same side of the street a couple of doors away from this that whoever broke in pistolwhipped the home’s occupants before stealing a bunch of stuff.
Then I came close to a self defence situation in my own home about three weeks ago.
I got woken up in the middle of the night by someone shaking the car door handle in the driveway. Once I realized that’s what the sound was, I started getting out of bed to see what was going on, and whoever was doing this stopped shaking the car door handle. I thought they gave up on the car and left. Then I heard the side door’s screen door open and the side door’s handle shaking.
*That* had me turn around and head back to the bedroom to get my phone when whoever it was stopped shaking the side door and they went round the back and tried the back door as I was grabbing my phone off it’s charger. Whoever it was took off once they realized the back door was locked as well. I don’t think they tried the front door unless they did that while I was still asleep before getting to the car in the driveway and waking me up.
Thankfully this didn’t turn into another home invasion or break-in since whoever this was didn’t progress beyond shaking door handles trying to find one that’s unlocked. However, if it had, I really wish there was greater backing in law to deal with it during the time between 911 getting called and police showing up.
PureInsaneAmbition on
Yes, please. We need to be able to protect our families.
DrunkCorgis on
No deleted comment, I just enjoy satire.
Adventurous-Hand3942 on
Go watch The Perfect Neighbor on netflix, we dont need that shit in Canada
Glowpop on
I think people shouldn’t break into houses terrifying homeowners.
chiaboy on
Frequency of home invasions matter. How often are they occurring up there? They’re pretty rare down here, surprised you guys have them frequently (if you do).
Article/op-ed didn’t mention how prevalent they are so unclear on if headline was hyperbole or not
2Shmoove on
What’s the frequency of home invasions these days? I didn’t see any stats. In fact, the article seemed to end abruptly after that sentence.
Reddit_BroZar on
If the system wants to charge me for defending my life in my own house against intruder then the system should be paying for my defense. We gonna see those charges dropped real damn quick.
37 Comments
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Has anyone ever been charged with an offence for fighting back during a home invasion?
Has the frequency of home invasions really become that big of a problem these days?
[removed]
I don’t want to go nuts on a burglar, but I also don’t want to be dragged through the court or have my life ruined with legal fees (~$30-$50K) if I err on the side of caution when faced with a threat in my own home.
My position on this issue is hardening due to the increase of violent invasions in Ontario – up over 50% in recent years – even though it looks like the number of burglaries has fallen by over 50% since 2000 (I know, seems unlikely but those do appear to be the stats).
Some countries have a system to recover court costs from the state when charges are withdrawn, or a higher bar to bring charges prior to a full investigation. Perhaps we can model their system to fit our needs, versus this seemingly ham-fisted approach?
My home is my sanctuary where I’m suppose to feel the safest and for the life of me I cannot understand why I don’t have the right to feel safe inside my home and defend it should someone try to invade my space. I’m not the one who’s in the wrong, the person(s) trying to rob me or steal from me are 100% in the wrong and I should be able to defend it. There’s no place like home.
Just an FYI so people understand.
It’s not Police who WANT to charge homeowners for defending themselves. It’s the Prosecutor and Crown that pushes and demands Police lay charges.
I can tell you with experience no Police officer goes to calls like this and say “ya I want to arrest and charge this homeowner for defending himself”.
Conservatives out of ideas. News at 11.
When you don’t know the intent of an intruder, and you don’t know whether they are armed or not, and you don’t know if there is more than one of them, you are at a disadvantage. That should lead to being given the benefit of the doubt. Why should the homeowner have to gamble with their life when they have no knowledge of the intent of the intruder? The intruder has the upper hand.
I’ve been downvoted time and again, but I still stand by the belief that the Americans have the right idea with their *2nd Amendment, Constitutional Carry*, and *Stand Your Ground* laws. They are wrong about a lot, but not this. People need to be able to defend themselves, from criminals and foreign aggressors; both of whom will have guns anyway.
The government should have far less power to tell adult citizens what they can’t own, let alone use to defend themselves. If someone starts trouble, and gets killed for it, that’s not a great loss. I doubt we’ll ever get a pro-gun government, so the best that sensible Canadians can hope for is to make good use of Jury Nullification if you’re ever on a self-defense trial.
“Fourteen years later, it’s time for another update, especially given the frequency of home invasions today.” If our government is saying this, why has everyone been saying violent crime is down?
Someone breaks into your home you should be given a lot of leeway. The way I see it is if someone breaks into my home and I call the police when the police arrive they will do so with a gun. If the intruder does not comply with their commands / becomes aggressive the e police will shoot them. I should be able to do the same within my home.
so… are we actually gonna get any change in polices or is this just fluff?
I think it’s pretty obvious Canadians want and need stronger self defence.
And yet, the headline posits ‘the frequency of home invasions these days’ and then completely fails to actually cite data that shows any actual increase in these events.
So here we are just doing a vibes-based encouragement for violence.
Cool.
Cool cool cool.
There’s an old farmer that lives up the road from me. Probably 15 years ago there was a rash of thefts on farms in the area. Everyone knew who it was but the cops wouldn’t/couldn’t do anything about it.
Buddy broke into the farmers shed one night and stole a couple gas cans. The cops showed up and the guy was sitting at the end of the driveway, he was in pretty rough shape, cuts and bruises all over.
Cop asked the farmer what happened to him. No idea officer he looked like that when he got here.
The thefts stopped after that night for some reason.
LPC: won’t somebody please think of the criminals?
It isn’t outdated. It was absurd at first instance.
I thought we were suppose to comply with the criminal. Give them whatever they want including our lives.
>especially given the frequency of home invasions today.
The article provides no data, only fear, so let’s do their work for them:
[StatsCan: break-and-enters down 26% per capita since 2015, down 43% since 2010, down 60% since 2005](https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/pub/75-006-x/2025001/article/00011-eng.htm).
The *Sun* doesn’t want you to be informed, they just want you to be terrified.
Toronto Sun fear-mongering again…
When someone breaks into your home, they have ill intentions by default.
They don’t care about you, your posessions, or the impact their action will have on you.
So in my book, they forfeited their rights.
If a dog kills an intruder, everyone would say it’s a good boy and no prosecutor would try to BE that dog. Why is it different for a home owner?
Maybe I’m alone on this but personally I think if you break into someone’s home you should basically forfeit your right to life during the duration of the robbery. Basically make sure these criminals know they are choosing other people’s stuff over their own lives
Yes, then maybe the trash breaking into peoples homes will think twice.
I think most people are in favour of self defense and defense of their property. I’d also believe police are in favour of it as well in principle. It’s a fine line to walk. The law could absolutely be abused to excuse you assaulting someone in your home for example. There are also excessive force limitations that need to be addressed. I want to be able to defend my home but I don’t necessarily want it to be legal for me to mag dump into a couple 15 year olds making a poor decision in search of beer money.
Your country lol. Import millions of 3rd worlders, still don’t allow self defense
“Frequency of home invasions these days”?!?!?!?! The rate of home break and enters has dropped more than than 70% over the past 30 years.
+1 💯%agree, especially when you can get hurt and the best medical care you can get is to sit on a stool in a corridor in ER for a day
The anti-self defence approach to self defence laws is absurd & outdated. It’s time for an update.
First of all, periodically reviewing and updating laws is probably a prudent thing to be doing anyways. I don’t think there’s much grounds for complaint about that.
Then there’s the issue of lived experience.
This is, or was, a relatively good neighbourhood but every so often, I’d hear from the various neighbours that stuff had been stolen out of cars or they saw someone trying car door handles.
However, last year, actual home invasions crept in right nearby. I came home to a letter from the police department tucked into my mail box last year canvassing for potential witnesses and CCTV footage from a home invasion that took place across the street a few houses down. The letter didn’t have many details but I heard from one of the neighbours who lived on the same side of the street a couple of doors away from this that whoever broke in pistolwhipped the home’s occupants before stealing a bunch of stuff.
Then I came close to a self defence situation in my own home about three weeks ago.
I got woken up in the middle of the night by someone shaking the car door handle in the driveway. Once I realized that’s what the sound was, I started getting out of bed to see what was going on, and whoever was doing this stopped shaking the car door handle. I thought they gave up on the car and left. Then I heard the side door’s screen door open and the side door’s handle shaking.
*That* had me turn around and head back to the bedroom to get my phone when whoever it was stopped shaking the side door and they went round the back and tried the back door as I was grabbing my phone off it’s charger. Whoever it was took off once they realized the back door was locked as well. I don’t think they tried the front door unless they did that while I was still asleep before getting to the car in the driveway and waking me up.
Thankfully this didn’t turn into another home invasion or break-in since whoever this was didn’t progress beyond shaking door handles trying to find one that’s unlocked. However, if it had, I really wish there was greater backing in law to deal with it during the time between 911 getting called and police showing up.
Yes, please. We need to be able to protect our families.
No deleted comment, I just enjoy satire.
Go watch The Perfect Neighbor on netflix, we dont need that shit in Canada
I think people shouldn’t break into houses terrifying homeowners.
Frequency of home invasions matter. How often are they occurring up there? They’re pretty rare down here, surprised you guys have them frequently (if you do).
Article/op-ed didn’t mention how prevalent they are so unclear on if headline was hyperbole or not
What’s the frequency of home invasions these days? I didn’t see any stats. In fact, the article seemed to end abruptly after that sentence.
If the system wants to charge me for defending my life in my own house against intruder then the system should be paying for my defense. We gonna see those charges dropped real damn quick.