government both labour and tory hates pubs its clear to see
[deleted] on
[deleted]
snapped_fork on
It’s going to take more than cutting VAT to make going to the pub more viable for a lot of people. Having a drink at home is just so much cheaper than a trip to the pub.
mrafinch on
Remember when the govt. dropped VAT from 17.5% to 15% to stimulate the economy… we old now!
(Not related, but I’ll always have a strange soft spot in my heart for 17.5% as our maths teacher used it as a good example to find derivative percentages)
Street_Adagio_2125 on
One big problem I have with pubs these days is they are shit. A good pub is usually rammed and requires booking a table in advance.
No-Potential-7242 on
I’m sick and tired of hospitality people putting their hands out. If your business is not viable now, it is not going to be viable when you’re getting special treatment at everyone else’s expense.
Hospitality provides shit jobs. Tax cuts need to be going to modern energy and other high-tech industries that can provide decent jobs.
technurse on
The problem is wealth inequality.
Pubs are dying because we have a massive wealth imbalance at the very top. We’re at risk of companies failing in their thousands simply because people can only afford essentials
you_aint_seen_me- on
It won’t save them, sadly. With so many Pubs owned by corporate entities, they’ll retain the current prices and pocket the windfall.
rawthorm on
Helping businesses during an affordability/cost of living crisis is little more than a band aid. You need to help actual people. If we weren’t all so fucking poor we might actually go to the pub again.
Matt-J-McCormack on
The whole brewing industry is taxed at every level. It’s fucked in this country.
But the rot runs deeper. CAMRA saved Cask in short order but spent the rest of the time demanding discount on the more specialist product and talking shit about Keg. The Tory party fucked over all the Big UK breweries and broke them up into Pub CO’s and hotel chains.
The Media also had a semi-on for binge drinking’ when the problem there was more spirits than Beer.
Rishi Sunak did make champagne cheaper for his mates though.
Edit: forgot to mention I really went off Tom Keridge over Lockdown since he made a three part series sucking the dick of Pub CO’s. Pub CO’s are basically an MLM, you pay them to run the pub and are locked into buying through them.
carrig on
Honestly an income tax cut that makes people feel a bit better off would probably help pubs more that a VAT reduction. Too many places provide a poor experience for the price and people don’t want to go.
JacobsRebuttle on
There are a couple of nearby pubs which have diversified what goes on day-to-day to bring in more demographics. For instance, having a Mario Kart night when people go up against each other on a big screen as people watch and participate. Brings in a younger crowd. Actually keeps the older ones happy too as they like that the pub has some life back in it. Of course there are quieter nights too for a good old chit chat. Adapt or die.
Flying_Wilson17 on
When you charge £7 a pint outside London, people will stop going!
1991atco on
We are continually being conditioned to be antisocial hermits. The world quite literally at your finger tips, streaming services, just eat and groceries directly to your door, there is little reason to leave the house and if there is a reason it won’t be for long because no one has the money to do it.
Pubs are and should remain a key part of our social economy and with the no and low ABV drinks market on the boom its a fully inclusive activity. I miss going to the pub just to see who’s there, no planning in advance, turn up, chat, leave.
Average_sheep1411 on
I need more disposable income and so do a lot more people.
WishboneGrouchy9639 on
People are all skint, choosing luxuries very carefully. Its not just pubs.
The massive wealth inequality is hitting almost every industry. Put disposable cash in everyone’s pockets and they will spend more.
CiderChugger on
Picked my favourite pub and that’s the only one I go to now in a vain attempt to prevent it from closing
ash_ninetyone on
Drinking habits are changing and some people would prefer to drink a tinnie at home than go to the pub.
I sometimes go to one of the few pubs open. Help they have independent real ales on tap as guests to try (I’d avoid the big brands if I could). But I’m in my mid 30s and find I’m often the youngest person in there, except maybe one or two of the serving staff
That’s not to insult or offend the older generation. But reality of life is that eventually they will die, and there’s no new custom coming in.
Dedward5 on
I live in the countryside, no pub is walkable and I don’t drink and drive. Back in the day a (a long time now) couple of pints was perfectly acceptable now it’s rightly not.
Neko9Neko on
No one wants to pay tax Heston. Why should pubs gets let off when ordinary people have to pay?
Rebberry on
Raising or lowering vat cannot and will never magically save or break the economy. Stop calling for vat changes and fix the underlying problems.
radiant_0wl on
I support a lower VAT rate but it’s not realistic, it would have to involve a radical fiscal change.
For the typical standard pub a VAT reduction of 2.5% is likely to be a few thousands of pounds. A reasonable amount but only a couple percent of revenue.
lumbridge6 on
My grand plan if I by some grand miracle I become the chancellor of the exchequer would be to hike taxes on supermarkets, off licences etc. And use that to offset tax on pubs
Ghostly_Wellington on
Who would have thought that sacrificing wages to maintain corporate profits would have consequences?!
waterswims on
I mean I was in a pub on match day not far from the stadium. 2 hours before the match it was dead, maybe 1 hour before the match it was 75% full.
I have to be honest there isn’t much demand for these businesses any more. Maybe it’s the costs or maybe people have moved on but tax cuts aren’t gonna save them.
Low_Map4314 on
Common sense policy changes don’t fly with the govt
Informal_Drawing on
Pretty sure he is doing alright at the moment.
The only thing that will “save” pubs is putting money in people’s back pockets for them to spend.
But the rich don’t want that because they tink all the money in the world should belong to them so we will continue like this until the entire country collapses.
ataturkseeyou on
I work in central London and 3 pints almost cost me 25 quid, spent about 100 quid in 2 hours (I can drink), how can I go out and drink at these prices (before Covid we used to go out after work every day)
I only go into the office once a week now post covid, it’s a expensive after work activity
franklindstallone on
If it went back to 17.5%, I’m afraid that’ll make zero difference. More so because we’ll end up paying in some other way. Mostly likely as same prices in the pub and higher taxes elsewhere to cover the loss of vat.
vent666 on
Went bike packing and stopped at a rural pub.
Local ale, serval £4 pints good food.
If town had something similar I’d jump at it
FogduckemonGo on
VAT cuts would be a start, but one of the real issues causing pub landlords grief is pub chain/wholesaler greed. They draw eager landlords in with good rates, then milk them for more and more until it’s impossible to make a living. Bring in another franchisee, get them to invest their money in a pub refresh, repeat every 2-3 years. Doesn’t help that a lot of the custom comes from keeping the menu + decor updated, having periodic reopenings as a “new”, exciting gastro pub.
OliLombi on
VAT has always been silly to me. You need to tax profit, not the product.
completefuckweasel on
Some of the highest beer duty rates in Europe (3 times higher than France, Italy and the Netherlands) plus 20% VAT mean that frequent visits to the pub are out of the question for many people in the UK.
33 Comments
government both labour and tory hates pubs its clear to see
[deleted]
It’s going to take more than cutting VAT to make going to the pub more viable for a lot of people. Having a drink at home is just so much cheaper than a trip to the pub.
Remember when the govt. dropped VAT from 17.5% to 15% to stimulate the economy… we old now!
(Not related, but I’ll always have a strange soft spot in my heart for 17.5% as our maths teacher used it as a good example to find derivative percentages)
One big problem I have with pubs these days is they are shit. A good pub is usually rammed and requires booking a table in advance.
I’m sick and tired of hospitality people putting their hands out. If your business is not viable now, it is not going to be viable when you’re getting special treatment at everyone else’s expense.
Hospitality provides shit jobs. Tax cuts need to be going to modern energy and other high-tech industries that can provide decent jobs.
The problem is wealth inequality.
Pubs are dying because we have a massive wealth imbalance at the very top. We’re at risk of companies failing in their thousands simply because people can only afford essentials
It won’t save them, sadly. With so many Pubs owned by corporate entities, they’ll retain the current prices and pocket the windfall.
Helping businesses during an affordability/cost of living crisis is little more than a band aid. You need to help actual people. If we weren’t all so fucking poor we might actually go to the pub again.
The whole brewing industry is taxed at every level. It’s fucked in this country.
But the rot runs deeper. CAMRA saved Cask in short order but spent the rest of the time demanding discount on the more specialist product and talking shit about Keg. The Tory party fucked over all the Big UK breweries and broke them up into Pub CO’s and hotel chains.
The Media also had a semi-on for binge drinking’ when the problem there was more spirits than Beer.
Rishi Sunak did make champagne cheaper for his mates though.
Edit: forgot to mention I really went off Tom Keridge over Lockdown since he made a three part series sucking the dick of Pub CO’s. Pub CO’s are basically an MLM, you pay them to run the pub and are locked into buying through them.
Honestly an income tax cut that makes people feel a bit better off would probably help pubs more that a VAT reduction. Too many places provide a poor experience for the price and people don’t want to go.
There are a couple of nearby pubs which have diversified what goes on day-to-day to bring in more demographics. For instance, having a Mario Kart night when people go up against each other on a big screen as people watch and participate. Brings in a younger crowd. Actually keeps the older ones happy too as they like that the pub has some life back in it. Of course there are quieter nights too for a good old chit chat. Adapt or die.
When you charge £7 a pint outside London, people will stop going!
We are continually being conditioned to be antisocial hermits. The world quite literally at your finger tips, streaming services, just eat and groceries directly to your door, there is little reason to leave the house and if there is a reason it won’t be for long because no one has the money to do it.
Pubs are and should remain a key part of our social economy and with the no and low ABV drinks market on the boom its a fully inclusive activity. I miss going to the pub just to see who’s there, no planning in advance, turn up, chat, leave.
I need more disposable income and so do a lot more people.
People are all skint, choosing luxuries very carefully. Its not just pubs.
The massive wealth inequality is hitting almost every industry. Put disposable cash in everyone’s pockets and they will spend more.
Picked my favourite pub and that’s the only one I go to now in a vain attempt to prevent it from closing
Drinking habits are changing and some people would prefer to drink a tinnie at home than go to the pub.
I sometimes go to one of the few pubs open. Help they have independent real ales on tap as guests to try (I’d avoid the big brands if I could). But I’m in my mid 30s and find I’m often the youngest person in there, except maybe one or two of the serving staff
That’s not to insult or offend the older generation. But reality of life is that eventually they will die, and there’s no new custom coming in.
I live in the countryside, no pub is walkable and I don’t drink and drive. Back in the day a (a long time now) couple of pints was perfectly acceptable now it’s rightly not.
No one wants to pay tax Heston. Why should pubs gets let off when ordinary people have to pay?
Raising or lowering vat cannot and will never magically save or break the economy. Stop calling for vat changes and fix the underlying problems.
I support a lower VAT rate but it’s not realistic, it would have to involve a radical fiscal change.
For the typical standard pub a VAT reduction of 2.5% is likely to be a few thousands of pounds. A reasonable amount but only a couple percent of revenue.
My grand plan if I by some grand miracle I become the chancellor of the exchequer would be to hike taxes on supermarkets, off licences etc. And use that to offset tax on pubs
Who would have thought that sacrificing wages to maintain corporate profits would have consequences?!
I mean I was in a pub on match day not far from the stadium. 2 hours before the match it was dead, maybe 1 hour before the match it was 75% full.
I have to be honest there isn’t much demand for these businesses any more. Maybe it’s the costs or maybe people have moved on but tax cuts aren’t gonna save them.
Common sense policy changes don’t fly with the govt
Pretty sure he is doing alright at the moment.
The only thing that will “save” pubs is putting money in people’s back pockets for them to spend.
But the rich don’t want that because they tink all the money in the world should belong to them so we will continue like this until the entire country collapses.
I work in central London and 3 pints almost cost me 25 quid, spent about 100 quid in 2 hours (I can drink), how can I go out and drink at these prices (before Covid we used to go out after work every day)
I only go into the office once a week now post covid, it’s a expensive after work activity
If it went back to 17.5%, I’m afraid that’ll make zero difference. More so because we’ll end up paying in some other way. Mostly likely as same prices in the pub and higher taxes elsewhere to cover the loss of vat.
Went bike packing and stopped at a rural pub.
Local ale, serval £4 pints good food.
If town had something similar I’d jump at it
VAT cuts would be a start, but one of the real issues causing pub landlords grief is pub chain/wholesaler greed. They draw eager landlords in with good rates, then milk them for more and more until it’s impossible to make a living. Bring in another franchisee, get them to invest their money in a pub refresh, repeat every 2-3 years. Doesn’t help that a lot of the custom comes from keeping the menu + decor updated, having periodic reopenings as a “new”, exciting gastro pub.
VAT has always been silly to me. You need to tax profit, not the product.
Some of the highest beer duty rates in Europe (3 times higher than France, Italy and the Netherlands) plus 20% VAT mean that frequent visits to the pub are out of the question for many people in the UK.