At the moment, a lot of people are a lot more worried about US suppliers having their hands in key European infrastructure.
ComplexWrangler1346 on
Ugh
BaldMigrant on
Good, do the same with US suppliers where possible, and provide financial and regulatory support in areas where EU alternatives are limited, so we can develop them.
Toums95 on
It’s only fine as long as American supplier are also cut out. Otherwise this is a move whose only result is to make ourselves even more dependent on the US and with less negotiation power or cards to play.
Edit: Also, I am not even sure it is viable without severely hindering development on said key technologies and be forced to lag behind everyone else, if at the same time we need to tackle the US dependency. That would be equally dangerous
outofband on
Comments here are delusional or outright propaganda. There is no EU alternative for those chips, it’s either China or US and if you read the article, EU is obeying US orders in this.
Ima_Wreckyou on
Why the constant hostility and fear mongering about China? They don’t seem to be the imperialist superpower who threatens Europe with annexation of allied territory, in fact they seek to have good trade relations with everyone.
EDIT:
Also to add, this approach is complete bullshit. It does not matter who creates the technology but how inspectable and transparent the technology is. And the reason why it’s not inspectable is because of laws to protect big tech that prevent reverse engineering and jailbreaking devices even for security research, the US forced on all it’s trading partners. The real solution would be to demand that all schematics of computing devices that are sold on the market, their firmware and software is open source and reproducible. But if you have technically illiterate morons in politics who don’t even understand this problems this completely unfit solution of banning individual countries is what you get.
After all we even have examples of the US infiltrating European companies to deploy their spyware and use it for espionage, so it’s a complete illusion that technology from Europe would be save if it’s all proprietary closed source garbage.
FrostyParking on
Strategic independence is a good thing…..but only if you actually try to do that, not play propaganda games while still being somebody else’s pawn.
Unhappy_Sugar_5091 on
what key European industry is getting phased out in competition? We are just bending the knee to Orange King in the West. There are only two options and Trump has forced EU to take US option. Rest is all sugar coated fluff to keep the masses entertained on idea of ‘security’, ‘sovereignty’ and pride.
Sad_Amphibian_2311 on
The US won’t allow us to use hardware without NSA backdoors. No news really.
Cahir_aep_Ceallach_ on
So instead of tackling the factually existing present day threat from the US that we are actively suffering from we should first take care of a hypothetical threat whose advent we have no evidence of whatsoever at this point in time?
Guys you have to trade with people. The more you isolate yourself from someone the more dependent you get from the remaining options.
And what reason do we even have to hold this axiomatic belief of China as this sinister force seeking our demise when all they have done is build wealth and welfare for their citizens within their own borders? Meanwhile the US has bombed, invaded, couped, coerced and economically destroyed countless countries across the world including within Europe for the past 100 years. Its genuinely just liberal propaganda that has indoctrinated us to the very core of our world views.
Let’s be real we considered the US and ourselves the “morally righteous” force of the world because the worst of our misdeeds and exploitation didnt occur within our lands but somewhere else in some poor distant countries you can ignore or have the CIA create some villain story for.
Its time to wake up and end this terrible era of atlanticism and neoliberalism and actually look out for the people
Upstairs-Mall-3695 on
Phase-out Chinese suppliers? About time. Can’t have Beijing holding the kill switch on our power grids and 5G
Aight1337 on
So when are they getting rid of TT then?
Any-Original-6113 on
Good news
Sigolon on
Target America! What threat does China pose to Europe? China should be a partner in curbing American power, and a source of inspiration for industrial policy.
g1umo on
We are being invaded by the US and Russia, naturally the only conclusion the braindead EU leaders come to is that it is now time to be more hostile towards China
CapableCollar on
Russia is a military threat to the east, the US is a military threat to the west. Deals with other major economies have been slow to develop as there are limited options and negotiations with EU parties take extensive amounts of time. China is an economic problem and potentially a political one but seems a less immediate concern compared to action taken. Response to the US and Russia seem comparatively slow. Even with Russia EU nations continue to knowingly purchase Russian energy through intermediaries and sell raw resources for refinement into military goods. Actions like this feel like skewed priorities driven more by what is politically easy than by what is more strategically advantageous.
uxgpf on
IDK if it is a good thing.
In a strategic sense Europe should close ties with China. I hate Chinese fascism and autocracy as much as everone else. Their treatment of non-han people like Uighurs.
However China thinks long term.
At this point in time it would be good to insulate the US.
Keep good relations with the South America and Canada. Defend them if the US invades.
Tell China that Taiwan is a no go. Make it clear they need us more than Russia.
No one wants to be on the losing side.
gookman on
This sub has become too friendly to a country that has declared infinite friendship with another country actively waging war on European soil. Maybe we should all remember that dictatorships are not our friends.
zauraz on
We need to do the same with the US
piercedmfootonaspike on
Honestly, I’m more concerned about relying on American infrastructure at this point. At least China is predictable.
Diffidente on
Chinese Propaganda is in full swing today on Reddit.
If it’s not that why there is so much support and apologetic excuses in favor of the chinese dictatorship.
I stand for Taiwan, for Hong Kong, for the people who died in the protests of Tienanmen Square, against the genocide of the Uyghurs.
The european values are incompatible with the chinese regime.
I want to see a more independent EU fron external actors.
incomingdrawing on
Its really hard to parse anything from this. the orange man doesn’t have to be involve for this to make sense, yet the timing is bad from a world events view. This could purely be a security move. Canada is leaning more on China and are very public about it.
JBWalker1 on
Let them build stuff, just not anything with communication equipment. Like let them build tunnels for a good price like they’re doing in Paris with parts of the new metro lines, but dont let them build the signals and comms equipment inside it.
23 Comments
At the moment, a lot of people are a lot more worried about US suppliers having their hands in key European infrastructure.
Ugh
Good, do the same with US suppliers where possible, and provide financial and regulatory support in areas where EU alternatives are limited, so we can develop them.
It’s only fine as long as American supplier are also cut out. Otherwise this is a move whose only result is to make ourselves even more dependent on the US and with less negotiation power or cards to play.
Edit: Also, I am not even sure it is viable without severely hindering development on said key technologies and be forced to lag behind everyone else, if at the same time we need to tackle the US dependency. That would be equally dangerous
Comments here are delusional or outright propaganda. There is no EU alternative for those chips, it’s either China or US and if you read the article, EU is obeying US orders in this.
Why the constant hostility and fear mongering about China? They don’t seem to be the imperialist superpower who threatens Europe with annexation of allied territory, in fact they seek to have good trade relations with everyone.
EDIT:
Also to add, this approach is complete bullshit. It does not matter who creates the technology but how inspectable and transparent the technology is. And the reason why it’s not inspectable is because of laws to protect big tech that prevent reverse engineering and jailbreaking devices even for security research, the US forced on all it’s trading partners. The real solution would be to demand that all schematics of computing devices that are sold on the market, their firmware and software is open source and reproducible. But if you have technically illiterate morons in politics who don’t even understand this problems this completely unfit solution of banning individual countries is what you get.
After all we even have examples of the US infiltrating European companies to deploy their spyware and use it for espionage, so it’s a complete illusion that technology from Europe would be save if it’s all proprietary closed source garbage.
Strategic independence is a good thing…..but only if you actually try to do that, not play propaganda games while still being somebody else’s pawn.
what key European industry is getting phased out in competition? We are just bending the knee to Orange King in the West. There are only two options and Trump has forced EU to take US option. Rest is all sugar coated fluff to keep the masses entertained on idea of ‘security’, ‘sovereignty’ and pride.
The US won’t allow us to use hardware without NSA backdoors. No news really.
So instead of tackling the factually existing present day threat from the US that we are actively suffering from we should first take care of a hypothetical threat whose advent we have no evidence of whatsoever at this point in time?
Guys you have to trade with people. The more you isolate yourself from someone the more dependent you get from the remaining options.
And what reason do we even have to hold this axiomatic belief of China as this sinister force seeking our demise when all they have done is build wealth and welfare for their citizens within their own borders? Meanwhile the US has bombed, invaded, couped, coerced and economically destroyed countless countries across the world including within Europe for the past 100 years. Its genuinely just liberal propaganda that has indoctrinated us to the very core of our world views.
Let’s be real we considered the US and ourselves the “morally righteous” force of the world because the worst of our misdeeds and exploitation didnt occur within our lands but somewhere else in some poor distant countries you can ignore or have the CIA create some villain story for.
Its time to wake up and end this terrible era of atlanticism and neoliberalism and actually look out for the people
Phase-out Chinese suppliers? About time. Can’t have Beijing holding the kill switch on our power grids and 5G
So when are they getting rid of TT then?
Good news
Target America! What threat does China pose to Europe? China should be a partner in curbing American power, and a source of inspiration for industrial policy.
We are being invaded by the US and Russia, naturally the only conclusion the braindead EU leaders come to is that it is now time to be more hostile towards China
Russia is a military threat to the east, the US is a military threat to the west. Deals with other major economies have been slow to develop as there are limited options and negotiations with EU parties take extensive amounts of time. China is an economic problem and potentially a political one but seems a less immediate concern compared to action taken. Response to the US and Russia seem comparatively slow. Even with Russia EU nations continue to knowingly purchase Russian energy through intermediaries and sell raw resources for refinement into military goods. Actions like this feel like skewed priorities driven more by what is politically easy than by what is more strategically advantageous.
IDK if it is a good thing.
In a strategic sense Europe should close ties with China. I hate Chinese fascism and autocracy as much as everone else. Their treatment of non-han people like Uighurs.
However China thinks long term.
At this point in time it would be good to insulate the US.
Keep good relations with the South America and Canada. Defend them if the US invades.
Tell China that Taiwan is a no go. Make it clear they need us more than Russia.
No one wants to be on the losing side.
This sub has become too friendly to a country that has declared infinite friendship with another country actively waging war on European soil. Maybe we should all remember that dictatorships are not our friends.
We need to do the same with the US
Honestly, I’m more concerned about relying on American infrastructure at this point. At least China is predictable.
Chinese Propaganda is in full swing today on Reddit.
If it’s not that why there is so much support and apologetic excuses in favor of the chinese dictatorship.
I stand for Taiwan, for Hong Kong, for the people who died in the protests of Tienanmen Square, against the genocide of the Uyghurs.
The european values are incompatible with the chinese regime.
I want to see a more independent EU fron external actors.
Its really hard to parse anything from this. the orange man doesn’t have to be involve for this to make sense, yet the timing is bad from a world events view. This could purely be a security move. Canada is leaning more on China and are very public about it.
Let them build stuff, just not anything with communication equipment. Like let them build tunnels for a good price like they’re doing in Paris with parts of the new metro lines, but dont let them build the signals and comms equipment inside it.