Yeah nobody wants to hear a racial slur but it wasn’t said with any intent behind it at all. The alternative is just not allowing anyone with tourettes to attend which is stupid. An apology was made and everyone moves on.
techbear72 on
Sounds like a complete nothingburger to me. Person who has Tourette’s syndrome shouts something offensive. Not exactly out of the ordinary for that condition.
RecentTwo544 on
Fairly simple in my book – was it *meant* as racist? Tourettes or not, it clearly wasn’t, so that’s the end of that.
I seriously think context should be WAY more important in things like this. On the plus side, I think this pseudo-fascist obsession with words rather than their actual meaning or intent is a great sign of how far we’ve come as a society. The fact people are so overly worried and policing language, as opposed to all the dreadful shit humans did in the past, is a clear marker we’ve largely solved the “wanton violence against people just because they’re different to us” issue that plagued most of human history, and are having to find new targets, quite innocently and not realising it is also a problem.
Captain-Mainwaring on
They handled it in probably the best way they could. I can only imagine John feels fucking horrible especially so because of the context of why he’s there and the later win by Aramayo for his portrayal of John.
Shining a very public light on the condition and making clear to the audience on a global scale that those that are affected by tourrettes have no control over what is said when they have a verbal tic.
Vast_Description_201 on
“Before he departed, Davidson also allegedly shouted “shut the fuck up” and “boring” when Bafta chair Sara Putt delivered a speech.”
I think we can all get behind that
floftie on
You can’t exclude people with disabilities because it offends people’s sensibilities.
Temporary_Sell3384 on
I think people here are being a bit obtuse. Of course we can all acknowledge that the slurs weren’t meant to be racist but they are a reflection of racism at large. That’s why the individual says them with other slurs. Because it *is* a slur.
This is a work event for these actors. If a colleague called you a slur involuntarily in front of everyone that was targeted at you it would bother you. People aren’t robots. Stiff upper lip attitudes are a silly response.
NJrose20 on
I don’t understand Tourettes but to me it seems like it’s “What’s the worst thing I could say right now” type thing and then it pops out. Absolute nightmare.
loverofthings25 on
Some of these comments are so dismissive yuck. Two things can be true, yes it’s a disability and he didn’t mean it but having a racial slur shouted at you by someone you don’t know can be hurtful.
xhatsux on
Mad how many people here are saying this is a non thing. You get up to give a presentation for your moment and then have a racial slur shouted at on National TV for everyone to see. It’s not ableist to still acknowledge this is fucked up even if you know the guy did because of his disability. The whole situation is not great for everyone involved.
Affectionate-Use8700 on
Just imagine how world-shatteringly embarrassed he probably feels right now for something that is the involuntarily equivalent of a sneeze to anyone else. My heart goes out to him.
RealPrinceJay on
In the comments: humans completely incapable of understanding that several things can be true at the same time
Did it suck for the actors on stage? Yeah, fucking obviously
Is what happened understandable and we can move past it in order to ensure people with disabilities still have space and are allowed to partake in these events? Yeah, fucking obviously
You can feel bad for the actors on stage and feel bad for the fellow with tourettes and want him to still be allowed to be in the room
You don’t have to pick sides you dingos
beIIe-and-sebastian on
If you wander into the more American black centric subs you can freely read how John needs to be beaten up or excluded from participating in society.
How lovely.
SuicideSkwad on
Twitter is an absolute cesspool over this right now, it seems Americans have no idea what Tourette’s is
electricmohair on
This situation is a huge indicator that more education is needed about Tourette’s, which is ironically what John Davidson himself has been campaigning about for all these years.
A lot of people are taking the stance of “I know he can’t help it, but surely he must be thinking racist things for that to be what he comes out with” which makes sense if you know nothing about the condition. But this particular symptom is called coprolalia and it means that somebody’s vocal tics are not random words, but are obscene or socially inappropriate. The person’s brain comes up with the worst possible thing that they could say in that situation and blurts it out. When John received his MBE he shouted “f- the queen” and told Buckingham Palace staff that he had a bomb.
So no, it is not a coincidence that he shouted the n word at these guys. But it’s not because he is secretly a racist and his Tourette’s is revealing that.
[deleted] on
[deleted]
YooGeOh on
I find a lot of the comments here a bit strange. Lots of people talking about tone policing and getting upset because its a nothingburger and that he didnt mean anything by it and its just how tourettes works.
I don’t find these comments strange because they’re wrong. I obviously agree with them. I find them strange because….nobody complained. Nobody is up in arms. Nobody is writing to the Baftas to ban him. Nobody is screaming racism. Nobody is upset at all…
Sometimes, as black people, yeah we have to deal with racism, sure, but a lot of the time, what I find more annoying is having to deal with people angry at us because they *preempt* an accusation lol. We’re just quietly observing, not bothered, and then here comes a bunch of people upset at what *they* *think* we might think at some point in the future
kiiwithebird on
ITT: black people calling for segregation, but this time against disabled people so it’s totally cool I guess…
PaintballProofMonk on
When I first read this headline, I thought… “Who on earth would be stupid enough to be offended or annoyed at something a Tourettes sufferer can’t help say?”
Then… I made the mistake of opening X…
*sigh*
It’s just… Hundreds if not thousands of African Americans who don’t seem to understand or care what Tourettes is…
Then there’s white people on both sides of the pond trying to explain to them and in response being told it’s just ‘white people looking for any excuse to call a brother the N-Word’…
That was… Rough on my consciousness.
LaCornucopia_ on
I’m just seeing loads of uneducated, selfish people (mainly yanks) being unable to show any kind of empathy or understanding, or being purposefully obtuse, towards a disabled man who has no control over what he says.
This is getting a lot of negative attention, and is ironically the entire point of the film. People are demonstrating tonight that they are, sadly but predictably, unable to learn the moral of it.
I hope that the actors who were on stage understand what has happened here (that there was no malice), and I hope that John gets the support he needs as a result of the childish, uneducated backlash.
kimbastern on
The n-word is not just a word to black people and people who have to exist under it. It’s just a word for those who consume it as entertainment. The difference is light years apart.
Similarly, Tourette’s is a truly debilitating condition that deserves understanding and empathy.
Two groups now have to deal with a truly horrible series of events. I hope they are able to do it with compassion, and honestly, outside the venom of the internet.
confusing_roundabout on
Kinda bugs me how literally every single top comment here is about sympathising with John.
Yes it’s not his fault but I still feel very bad for the actors essentially getting racially abused. In the moment they won’t have that context and it just ruins what should be a nice moment for them.
Electrical_Mango_489 on
Understanding racism?!
“John Davidson”
Ah. Racism is disgusting and I’m sorry Lindo and Jordan had to go through it. But please leave John alone he probably feels like sh*t enough as a result. Go an watch the film I Swear, or better yet the “I Swear I Can’t Help It” documentary on Prime.
ShrimplyKrilliant on
It’s just a terrible and sad situation for everyone involved. I hope both parties can recover from this someday.
CrowVsWade on
This may be the beginning of COVID 20, turning everyone into Cartman. It seems a not insignificant portion of the population may already have the virus.
highonpixels on
Since I see this event being posted and talked about alot can someone ELI5 some science behind the condition (Coprolalia) ?
I understand the general condition of Tourettes but Coprolalia is something I read a lot in comments. I’m intrigued by it’s behaviour and is it cause by a very specific part of the brain? I’m guessing the person with Tourettes must of learned the phrases and vocab that can be deemed offensive but it’s interesting how the ticks can cause this behaviour. Did a lil bit of reading on wiki but seems research is still ongoing.
The mind and body works in wonderful and weird ways.
onunfil on
It hurts for everyone involved. Can’t really blame MBJ and Lindon for feeling offended regardless of intent.
ding_0_dong on
Anyone want to deny cancel culture? The fear of saying something wrong could lead to you not working again
im_just_called_lucy on
It was a difficult situation.
There’s a dilemma at hand. You either *exclude* a disabled man from an awards ceremony awarding a film about him and his community accepting his disability because of the risk of inappropriate language being used as ticks (completely going against the clear message of the film) OR you include the person but risk others being hurt being the language ticks.
I’ve heard a lot of reactions online. What I tend to gather is that whilst everyone unanimously believes that Delroy and Michael should not have heard that word being shouted towards them and should be apologised to, the British opinions tend to be more sympathetic towards John whilst Americans tend to be less sympathetic, suggesting that he is expressing his own racist thoughts through ticks. I believe this is because in the U.K. from my own experience, Tourette’s is more widely known about because Tourette’s is more frequently highlighted in British media than in an American media. One of our biggest pop stars lives with Tourette’s and made a popular documentary about it which won awards in the U.K.. We know that ticks are not controllable, that people with these ticks feel deeply embarrassed by them and that we should not exclude them from society, including the arts.
In my opinion, BAFTA did what they could without sending the message that people with Tourette’s need to be hidden away as freaks unworthy of acceptance. They told everyone before cameras rolled that any inappropriate language was not intentional and was because of an audience member with Tourette’s. John decided to leave on his accord midway through the show because he was upset that his ticks were heightened. I can imagine being the subject of a BAFTA nominated film is huge for John and I understand why he wanted to be there to support the film. Maybe they could have edited the slur out for viewers (it’s pre recorded and at 11pm hours after the airing, I still could hear the slur said on iPlayer) but for the audience there, this was the best thing. It’s horrible that these disturbing slurs are said. It’s horrible to exclude disabled people despite promoting inclusion. Nobody wins. I hope Delroy & Michael get full personal apologies from both John and BAFTA and this moment spreads of awareness of Tourette’s.
missydarling23 on
All of these comments are so “poor john” but not showing an ounce of empathy for MBJ or Delroy? Then again ppl are so used to black ppl just dealing w racism on the chin, so no one cares. It’s hurtful. Regardless if it was intentional or not (and ik it’s not) but still, it hurts, and if you aren’t black then you wouldn’t understand.
NeverCadburys on
There are so many people who are saying “oh it is terrible that tourettes can cause people to say horrible things uncontrollably but maybe he should have done better to stop himself saying a racial slur”. Define uncontrollable for me.
People with tourettes go into airports and shout they are terrorists and going to blow people up. I have heard someone with tourettes say “your baby is dead” to a pregnant woman. It is a horrible disease because the words literally are uncontrollable.
There is nothing malicious here. and that guy was there because there was a film about him. This kind of thing was the whole point of the film. Irony isn’t even in it.
Just. yes it’s terrible he said a racial slur, but people’s ableism are coming out thick and strong here. “He should not have been invited, he should have stayed home” the nazis called, they want their policies back.
d_repz on
The people thinking that Black people would laugh off this incident where a man refers to two world-renowned Black actors who were onstage to present an award in his film’s category uses the N-word in reference to them while claiming Tourettes as the reason for his outburst are simply delusional. It’s clearly a word that he’s used severally in the past and was comfortable with doing so at such a prestigious event. I have read comments from people in other posts about the incident who are also affilicted with Tourettes, academics included, who have never used the N-word.
If you’re not Black please don’t speak for Black people.
Edit: Also, the BAFTA organisers should bear some blame for this, they knew he suffers from coprolalia and still put him within earshot of others?! Farcical.
Romado on
As a Tourette’s campaigner and someone with Tourette’s, John should have known he shouldn’t be in this environment and there was a risk he’d say something like this.
I don’t get to go to the BAFTA’s either. It’s not like it’s the local shop or something. He could have just not gone and avoided saying deeply offensive things on national TV.
33 Comments
Is it just me or is this not really a problem?
Yeah nobody wants to hear a racial slur but it wasn’t said with any intent behind it at all. The alternative is just not allowing anyone with tourettes to attend which is stupid. An apology was made and everyone moves on.
Sounds like a complete nothingburger to me. Person who has Tourette’s syndrome shouts something offensive. Not exactly out of the ordinary for that condition.
Fairly simple in my book – was it *meant* as racist? Tourettes or not, it clearly wasn’t, so that’s the end of that.
I seriously think context should be WAY more important in things like this. On the plus side, I think this pseudo-fascist obsession with words rather than their actual meaning or intent is a great sign of how far we’ve come as a society. The fact people are so overly worried and policing language, as opposed to all the dreadful shit humans did in the past, is a clear marker we’ve largely solved the “wanton violence against people just because they’re different to us” issue that plagued most of human history, and are having to find new targets, quite innocently and not realising it is also a problem.
They handled it in probably the best way they could. I can only imagine John feels fucking horrible especially so because of the context of why he’s there and the later win by Aramayo for his portrayal of John.
Shining a very public light on the condition and making clear to the audience on a global scale that those that are affected by tourrettes have no control over what is said when they have a verbal tic.
“Before he departed, Davidson also allegedly shouted “shut the fuck up” and “boring” when Bafta chair Sara Putt delivered a speech.”
I think we can all get behind that
You can’t exclude people with disabilities because it offends people’s sensibilities.
I think people here are being a bit obtuse. Of course we can all acknowledge that the slurs weren’t meant to be racist but they are a reflection of racism at large. That’s why the individual says them with other slurs. Because it *is* a slur.
This is a work event for these actors. If a colleague called you a slur involuntarily in front of everyone that was targeted at you it would bother you. People aren’t robots. Stiff upper lip attitudes are a silly response.
I don’t understand Tourettes but to me it seems like it’s “What’s the worst thing I could say right now” type thing and then it pops out. Absolute nightmare.
Some of these comments are so dismissive yuck. Two things can be true, yes it’s a disability and he didn’t mean it but having a racial slur shouted at you by someone you don’t know can be hurtful.
Mad how many people here are saying this is a non thing. You get up to give a presentation for your moment and then have a racial slur shouted at on National TV for everyone to see. It’s not ableist to still acknowledge this is fucked up even if you know the guy did because of his disability. The whole situation is not great for everyone involved.
Just imagine how world-shatteringly embarrassed he probably feels right now for something that is the involuntarily equivalent of a sneeze to anyone else. My heart goes out to him.
In the comments: humans completely incapable of understanding that several things can be true at the same time
Did it suck for the actors on stage? Yeah, fucking obviously
Is what happened understandable and we can move past it in order to ensure people with disabilities still have space and are allowed to partake in these events? Yeah, fucking obviously
You can feel bad for the actors on stage and feel bad for the fellow with tourettes and want him to still be allowed to be in the room
You don’t have to pick sides you dingos
If you wander into the more American black centric subs you can freely read how John needs to be beaten up or excluded from participating in society.
How lovely.
Twitter is an absolute cesspool over this right now, it seems Americans have no idea what Tourette’s is
This situation is a huge indicator that more education is needed about Tourette’s, which is ironically what John Davidson himself has been campaigning about for all these years.
A lot of people are taking the stance of “I know he can’t help it, but surely he must be thinking racist things for that to be what he comes out with” which makes sense if you know nothing about the condition. But this particular symptom is called coprolalia and it means that somebody’s vocal tics are not random words, but are obscene or socially inappropriate. The person’s brain comes up with the worst possible thing that they could say in that situation and blurts it out. When John received his MBE he shouted “f- the queen” and told Buckingham Palace staff that he had a bomb.
So no, it is not a coincidence that he shouted the n word at these guys. But it’s not because he is secretly a racist and his Tourette’s is revealing that.
[deleted]
I find a lot of the comments here a bit strange. Lots of people talking about tone policing and getting upset because its a nothingburger and that he didnt mean anything by it and its just how tourettes works.
I don’t find these comments strange because they’re wrong. I obviously agree with them. I find them strange because….nobody complained. Nobody is up in arms. Nobody is writing to the Baftas to ban him. Nobody is screaming racism. Nobody is upset at all…
Sometimes, as black people, yeah we have to deal with racism, sure, but a lot of the time, what I find more annoying is having to deal with people angry at us because they *preempt* an accusation lol. We’re just quietly observing, not bothered, and then here comes a bunch of people upset at what *they* *think* we might think at some point in the future
ITT: black people calling for segregation, but this time against disabled people so it’s totally cool I guess…
When I first read this headline, I thought… “Who on earth would be stupid enough to be offended or annoyed at something a Tourettes sufferer can’t help say?”
Then… I made the mistake of opening X…
*sigh*
It’s just… Hundreds if not thousands of African Americans who don’t seem to understand or care what Tourettes is…
Then there’s white people on both sides of the pond trying to explain to them and in response being told it’s just ‘white people looking for any excuse to call a brother the N-Word’…
That was… Rough on my consciousness.
I’m just seeing loads of uneducated, selfish people (mainly yanks) being unable to show any kind of empathy or understanding, or being purposefully obtuse, towards a disabled man who has no control over what he says.
This is getting a lot of negative attention, and is ironically the entire point of the film. People are demonstrating tonight that they are, sadly but predictably, unable to learn the moral of it.
I hope that the actors who were on stage understand what has happened here (that there was no malice), and I hope that John gets the support he needs as a result of the childish, uneducated backlash.
The n-word is not just a word to black people and people who have to exist under it. It’s just a word for those who consume it as entertainment. The difference is light years apart.
Similarly, Tourette’s is a truly debilitating condition that deserves understanding and empathy.
Two groups now have to deal with a truly horrible series of events. I hope they are able to do it with compassion, and honestly, outside the venom of the internet.
Kinda bugs me how literally every single top comment here is about sympathising with John.
Yes it’s not his fault but I still feel very bad for the actors essentially getting racially abused. In the moment they won’t have that context and it just ruins what should be a nice moment for them.
Understanding racism?!
“John Davidson”
Ah. Racism is disgusting and I’m sorry Lindo and Jordan had to go through it. But please leave John alone he probably feels like sh*t enough as a result. Go an watch the film I Swear, or better yet the “I Swear I Can’t Help It” documentary on Prime.
It’s just a terrible and sad situation for everyone involved. I hope both parties can recover from this someday.
This may be the beginning of COVID 20, turning everyone into Cartman. It seems a not insignificant portion of the population may already have the virus.
Since I see this event being posted and talked about alot can someone ELI5 some science behind the condition (Coprolalia) ?
I understand the general condition of Tourettes but Coprolalia is something I read a lot in comments. I’m intrigued by it’s behaviour and is it cause by a very specific part of the brain? I’m guessing the person with Tourettes must of learned the phrases and vocab that can be deemed offensive but it’s interesting how the ticks can cause this behaviour. Did a lil bit of reading on wiki but seems research is still ongoing.
The mind and body works in wonderful and weird ways.
It hurts for everyone involved. Can’t really blame MBJ and Lindon for feeling offended regardless of intent.
Anyone want to deny cancel culture? The fear of saying something wrong could lead to you not working again
It was a difficult situation.
There’s a dilemma at hand. You either *exclude* a disabled man from an awards ceremony awarding a film about him and his community accepting his disability because of the risk of inappropriate language being used as ticks (completely going against the clear message of the film) OR you include the person but risk others being hurt being the language ticks.
I’ve heard a lot of reactions online. What I tend to gather is that whilst everyone unanimously believes that Delroy and Michael should not have heard that word being shouted towards them and should be apologised to, the British opinions tend to be more sympathetic towards John whilst Americans tend to be less sympathetic, suggesting that he is expressing his own racist thoughts through ticks. I believe this is because in the U.K. from my own experience, Tourette’s is more widely known about because Tourette’s is more frequently highlighted in British media than in an American media. One of our biggest pop stars lives with Tourette’s and made a popular documentary about it which won awards in the U.K.. We know that ticks are not controllable, that people with these ticks feel deeply embarrassed by them and that we should not exclude them from society, including the arts.
In my opinion, BAFTA did what they could without sending the message that people with Tourette’s need to be hidden away as freaks unworthy of acceptance. They told everyone before cameras rolled that any inappropriate language was not intentional and was because of an audience member with Tourette’s. John decided to leave on his accord midway through the show because he was upset that his ticks were heightened. I can imagine being the subject of a BAFTA nominated film is huge for John and I understand why he wanted to be there to support the film. Maybe they could have edited the slur out for viewers (it’s pre recorded and at 11pm hours after the airing, I still could hear the slur said on iPlayer) but for the audience there, this was the best thing. It’s horrible that these disturbing slurs are said. It’s horrible to exclude disabled people despite promoting inclusion. Nobody wins. I hope Delroy & Michael get full personal apologies from both John and BAFTA and this moment spreads of awareness of Tourette’s.
All of these comments are so “poor john” but not showing an ounce of empathy for MBJ or Delroy? Then again ppl are so used to black ppl just dealing w racism on the chin, so no one cares. It’s hurtful. Regardless if it was intentional or not (and ik it’s not) but still, it hurts, and if you aren’t black then you wouldn’t understand.
There are so many people who are saying “oh it is terrible that tourettes can cause people to say horrible things uncontrollably but maybe he should have done better to stop himself saying a racial slur”. Define uncontrollable for me.
People with tourettes go into airports and shout they are terrorists and going to blow people up. I have heard someone with tourettes say “your baby is dead” to a pregnant woman. It is a horrible disease because the words literally are uncontrollable.
There is nothing malicious here. and that guy was there because there was a film about him. This kind of thing was the whole point of the film. Irony isn’t even in it.
Just. yes it’s terrible he said a racial slur, but people’s ableism are coming out thick and strong here. “He should not have been invited, he should have stayed home” the nazis called, they want their policies back.
The people thinking that Black people would laugh off this incident where a man refers to two world-renowned Black actors who were onstage to present an award in his film’s category uses the N-word in reference to them while claiming Tourettes as the reason for his outburst are simply delusional. It’s clearly a word that he’s used severally in the past and was comfortable with doing so at such a prestigious event. I have read comments from people in other posts about the incident who are also affilicted with Tourettes, academics included, who have never used the N-word.
If you’re not Black please don’t speak for Black people.
Edit: Also, the BAFTA organisers should bear some blame for this, they knew he suffers from coprolalia and still put him within earshot of others?! Farcical.
As a Tourette’s campaigner and someone with Tourette’s, John should have known he shouldn’t be in this environment and there was a risk he’d say something like this.
I don’t get to go to the BAFTA’s either. It’s not like it’s the local shop or something. He could have just not gone and avoided saying deeply offensive things on national TV.